Na lugosevem dopisnem seznamu poteka zanimiva razprava o slovenjenju tipk na tipkovnici.
Več o njej si lahko preberete v arhivih, na dopisni seznam pa se lahko prijavite tukaj
torek, 21. december 2010
ponedeljek, 13. december 2010
Prevajalsko pivo
Prevajalsko pivo smo s preteklega tedna prestavili na jutri, 14.12. ob 19.00.
Mesto srečanja ostaja isto, bar Cezar pri Ljubljanski borzi.
Mesto srečanja ostaja isto, bar Cezar pri Ljubljanski borzi.
torek, 7. december 2010
Improving translation consistency with dictionary display in Rosetta
MULTIPLE DICTIONARIES
A few weeks ago I read an article about 10 problems that should be solved in Ubuntu. One of the problems was that are two strings: Recycle bin and Trash can. This really made me smile. While everyone agrees this is a problem, it is nothing compared to the challenges Non-English users are faced to. For almost every word in English there are multiple translations used in FLOSS software by Slovenian language (situation is similar in other languages I am at least partially fluent in). Additionally there are many strings, which were invented to describe a function of the software and don't exist outside the software world (I am talking about strings such as anycast or demultiplexer). These strings have no direct translations. To make things even more interesting some strings have multiple meanings in English (such as N/A which can mean either not available or not applicable).
If we are to offer the same quality of Ubuntu experience for Non-English users we need to unify translation strings. A question HOW? immediately pops up. Use a dictionary. Which one? Google Translate? Not specialized for FLOSS software (also very wrong sometimes). Use national Evoterm dictionary? It looks too Windows oriented. Then use some FLOSS dictionary. But which one? As always with volunteer projects people have various opinions and hence sometimes choose different options when translating.
In the past there was Slovenian dictionary (is some cases more like accepted strings within the project not formally published) for Gnome, KDE, Firefox, OpenOffice etc and each Linux distribution is also using own translation strings. Multiple groups had each their own dictionary, which are at least slightly incompatible.
UNITING DICTIONARIES
To solve that problem we decided to accept a common uniting dictionary. In order to speed up the word approval process we decided to start on small scale. This was about one year ago. Initially there was cooperation between Gnome and Ubuntu translators groups and later KDE also joined the fun :). The result is a dictionary Pojmovnik (please ignore the certificate warning) that is ambitiously trying to combine all of local FLOSS dictionaries into a single dictionary. Currently it holds some 860 words, which means more than two words are added per day in average.
TRANSLATION QUALITY ASSURANCE
Of course the dictionary needs to be used and old translations need to be fixed and terminology synchronized. To do that we spent the majority of Gnome 2.32 and Ubuntu 10.10 release cycle reviewing all .po files, removing old and adding new terminology and also fixing hundreds of minor bugs such as misspellings, which have lingered around for ages. As such Ubuntu 10.10 is dramatically more polished language wise compared to previous releases. Work was relatively easy for gnome packages using translation tools. Of course they weren't 100% effective so line per line review was still required, but there was no such possibility in Launchpad.
Additionally we wanted to have a way to easily suggest accepted terminology within Launchpad as changing tabs and searching for strings is not practical. Besides improving translations quality this could significantly increase translation pace.
We also discussed this at #ubuntu-translators but couldn't find fast and easy solution for us.
DICTIONARY DISPLAY IN ROSETTA
Then we started search for alternatives and found a nice Firefox extension, EHTip which is perfect for solving our problem. Extension uses local dictionary that can be prepared with simple syntax: "English word=Foreign word". Each string has to be in its own row and file saved into UTF-8 file format, saved for example with Gedit program. One of our tech savvy users created a bash script to transform dictionary wiki page into the syntax required by Firefox extension. Advantage of the extension is that it can be also used on other online translation pages such as Pootle. It's worth noting the extension author is planning to have Chrome-ium extension done by January 2011. We have also created detailed print-screen step-by-step instructions how to implement this solution. Several translators have started using it since (we created final version only last week), and they are reporting this has made their translation workflow much smoother and efficient. Such a success in such a short time is because of simplicity of us: Move mouse over English word and pop-up with translation appears. Can't be easier. See image below.
As we are very proud of our solution we are sharing it with everyone so you can use it in other translation teams as well.
If you are a translator please let us know how do you handle this. Is terminology a problem in your language? How are you trying to solve it and how successful are you? Please share your thoughts in the comments as we are very keen to know them. :)
A few weeks ago I read an article about 10 problems that should be solved in Ubuntu. One of the problems was that are two strings: Recycle bin and Trash can. This really made me smile. While everyone agrees this is a problem, it is nothing compared to the challenges Non-English users are faced to. For almost every word in English there are multiple translations used in FLOSS software by Slovenian language (situation is similar in other languages I am at least partially fluent in). Additionally there are many strings, which were invented to describe a function of the software and don't exist outside the software world (I am talking about strings such as anycast or demultiplexer). These strings have no direct translations. To make things even more interesting some strings have multiple meanings in English (such as N/A which can mean either not available or not applicable).
If we are to offer the same quality of Ubuntu experience for Non-English users we need to unify translation strings. A question HOW? immediately pops up. Use a dictionary. Which one? Google Translate? Not specialized for FLOSS software (also very wrong sometimes). Use national Evoterm dictionary? It looks too Windows oriented. Then use some FLOSS dictionary. But which one? As always with volunteer projects people have various opinions and hence sometimes choose different options when translating.
In the past there was Slovenian dictionary (is some cases more like accepted strings within the project not formally published) for Gnome, KDE, Firefox, OpenOffice etc and each Linux distribution is also using own translation strings. Multiple groups had each their own dictionary, which are at least slightly incompatible.
UNITING DICTIONARIES
To solve that problem we decided to accept a common uniting dictionary. In order to speed up the word approval process we decided to start on small scale. This was about one year ago. Initially there was cooperation between Gnome and Ubuntu translators groups and later KDE also joined the fun :). The result is a dictionary Pojmovnik (please ignore the certificate warning) that is ambitiously trying to combine all of local FLOSS dictionaries into a single dictionary. Currently it holds some 860 words, which means more than two words are added per day in average.
TRANSLATION QUALITY ASSURANCE
Of course the dictionary needs to be used and old translations need to be fixed and terminology synchronized. To do that we spent the majority of Gnome 2.32 and Ubuntu 10.10 release cycle reviewing all .po files, removing old and adding new terminology and also fixing hundreds of minor bugs such as misspellings, which have lingered around for ages. As such Ubuntu 10.10 is dramatically more polished language wise compared to previous releases. Work was relatively easy for gnome packages using translation tools. Of course they weren't 100% effective so line per line review was still required, but there was no such possibility in Launchpad.
Additionally we wanted to have a way to easily suggest accepted terminology within Launchpad as changing tabs and searching for strings is not practical. Besides improving translations quality this could significantly increase translation pace.
We also discussed this at #ubuntu-translators but couldn't find fast and easy solution for us.
DICTIONARY DISPLAY IN ROSETTA
Then we started search for alternatives and found a nice Firefox extension, EHTip which is perfect for solving our problem. Extension uses local dictionary that can be prepared with simple syntax: "English word=Foreign word". Each string has to be in its own row and file saved into UTF-8 file format, saved for example with Gedit program. One of our tech savvy users created a bash script to transform dictionary wiki page into the syntax required by Firefox extension. Advantage of the extension is that it can be also used on other online translation pages such as Pootle. It's worth noting the extension author is planning to have Chrome-ium extension done by January 2011. We have also created detailed print-screen step-by-step instructions how to implement this solution. Several translators have started using it since (we created final version only last week), and they are reporting this has made their translation workflow much smoother and efficient. Such a success in such a short time is because of simplicity of us: Move mouse over English word and pop-up with translation appears. Can't be easier. See image below.
As we are very proud of our solution we are sharing it with everyone so you can use it in other translation teams as well.
If you are a translator please let us know how do you handle this. Is terminology a problem in your language? How are you trying to solve it and how successful are you? Please share your thoughts in the comments as we are very keen to know them. :)
ponedeljek, 6. december 2010
Izšel je GCompris 9.4
Izšla je nova različica GCompris 9.4, paketa kakovostnih izobraževalnih iger za otroke med 2 in 10 let.
Vsebuje različne kategorije iger kot so programi odkrivanja računalnika (uporaba miške in tipkovnice), računanja (spomin, seštevanje, odštevanje, večkratniki, praštevila, ...), znanosti(vodni krog, podmornice, električno vezje), geografije (imena držav), igre (štiri v vrsto, šah) in druge stvari kot poznavanje ure, povezovanje slavnih slik, itd .
Sicer ponavadi ne objavljamo izida posameznih programov, vendar program zaradi svoje naravnanosti zahteva tudi zvočna navodila (majhni otroci ne znajo brati), ki jih je (več kot 200 zvokov) s prefinjenim glasom posnela Saša. Hvala !
Poleg tega smo dodali tudi obširen seznam besed, ki jih morajo otroci natipkati preden padejo na tla (učenje tipkanja) in posodobili in popravili prevode v programu.
Sedaj bi morala biti slovenska izkušnja v gcompris praktično brezhibna, če pa najdete kakšno napako, nam jo sporočite.
Več o GCompris 9.4 lahko izveste tukaj.
Vsebuje različne kategorije iger kot so programi odkrivanja računalnika (uporaba miške in tipkovnice), računanja (spomin, seštevanje, odštevanje, večkratniki, praštevila, ...), znanosti(vodni krog, podmornice, električno vezje), geografije (imena držav), igre (štiri v vrsto, šah) in druge stvari kot poznavanje ure, povezovanje slavnih slik, itd .
Sicer ponavadi ne objavljamo izida posameznih programov, vendar program zaradi svoje naravnanosti zahteva tudi zvočna navodila (majhni otroci ne znajo brati), ki jih je (več kot 200 zvokov) s prefinjenim glasom posnela Saša. Hvala !
Poleg tega smo dodali tudi obširen seznam besed, ki jih morajo otroci natipkati preden padejo na tla (učenje tipkanja) in posodobili in popravili prevode v programu.
Sedaj bi morala biti slovenska izkušnja v gcompris praktično brezhibna, če pa najdete kakšno napako, nam jo sporočite.
Več o GCompris 9.4 lahko izveste tukaj.
Prevajalsko pivo - december
Kot smo se dogovorili ne sestanku prejšnji ponedeljek, se dobimo na prevajalskem pivu to sredo ob 19.00 in v splošnem vsako 2. sredo v mesecu ob 19.00 uri.
Dobimo se v baru Cezar pri Lj borzi.
Če se nameravate piva udeležiti, to sporočite na klepetalnici ali pa v komentarjih. Veseli december nam namreč narekuje pitje kuhanega vina. :)
Glede na pivske želje bomo demokratično glasovali ali bomo ostali na pivu ali pa se bomo odpravil proti centru in kuhanemu vinu. Zato svojo udeležbo sporočite, da se v primeru vaše zamude ne bomo odpravili proti kuhanemu vinu (če bomo tako izglasovali) brez vas.
Dobimo se v baru Cezar pri Lj borzi.
Če se nameravate piva udeležiti, to sporočite na klepetalnici ali pa v komentarjih. Veseli december nam namreč narekuje pitje kuhanega vina. :)
Glede na pivske želje bomo demokratično glasovali ali bomo ostali na pivu ali pa se bomo odpravil proti centru in kuhanemu vinu. Zato svojo udeležbo sporočite, da se v primeru vaše zamude ne bomo odpravili proti kuhanemu vinu (če bomo tako izglasovali) brez vas.
nedelja, 5. december 2010
Vodnik o uporabi Lokalize
Lokalize je program namiznega okolja KDE za urejanje katalogov gettext (datotek .po), ki jih za prevajanje uporablja velika večina odprtokodnih programov. Program sam še ni v celoti preveden, vendar vas naj to ne moti.
Napredno
Sedaj, ko obvladate osnovne prijeme, pa se lahko pomaknemo na naprednejše funkcije programa. Ena izmed njih je posodobitev nizov iz predloge prevoda programa, datoteke .pot. V ta namen potrebujete predlogo (datoteko .pot) in že prevedene nize (datoteko .po).
Odprite datoteko .pot in izberite Sync > Odpri datoteko za uskladitev/spajanje. Izberite datoteko .po z že prevedenimi nizi in jo odprite. Sedaj izberite Sync > Copy all new translations ali pritisnite kombinacijo tipk Ctrl+Alt+A in datoteka se bo samodejno uskladila. Sedaj jo le še shranite in prevedite nize, ki niso bili samodejno prevedeni.
Preizkus prevoda
Da prevod preizkusite, morate datoteko .po pretvoriti v obliko .mo. V ta namen morate izvesti zunanji ukaz, saj Lokalize ne omogoča samodejne pretvorbe.
Namestite ga lahko s pomočjo ukazne vrstice:
sudo apt-get install lokalize
ali pa preko upravljalnika programov KDE KPackageKit.
Osnove
Ko ga odprete, se prikaže prazno okno:
V Nastavitve > Nastavi Lokalize spremenite/dopolnite podatke v zavihku Identity, da bo možno izvedeti kdo je katero datoteko prevedel in bo tako koordinacija prevodov lažja
Za začetek prevajanja morate imeti datoteko .po.
Odprite jo in pokazal se vam bo sledeči pogled. Pomembnejši deli so označeni z barvami.
Povlecite okvirje tako, da si boste prilagodili delovno okolje po meri.
Sedaj najprej izberite Project > Configure project in nastavite zavihek Personal tako, da se bo vaša vloga ujemala z resnično. Če ste le prevajalec nastavite Translator, če pa preglejujete nize ali jih potrjujete pa si nastavite na Reviewer ali Approver.
Sedaj lahko pričnete s prevajanjem.
Zelena obroba:
Niz za prevajanje se nahaja na vrhu v sivem okvirju, medtem ko je vaš niz spodaj v belem okvirju. Če niz še slučajno ni preveden, bo imel Translation status: Untranslated, belo polje za vaš prevod pa bo prazno. V tem primeru pritisnite kombinacijo tipk Ctrl+Preslednica in izvorni niz iz sivega polja se bo samodejno skopiral v belo polje.
Temno modra obroba:
Če za kateri niz niste prepričani, kliknite na gumb Approved in spremenite Translation status v Needs review. To pomeni, da bo moral nekdo niz pregledati, preden bo potrjen in uporabljen.
Roza obroba:
Eden izmed pomembnih podatkov se nahaja v okvirčku Unit metadata. Tu so zbrani vsi komentarji, ki so jih avtorji programa dodali, da bi bilo prevajanje lažje. Semkaj lahko dodate tudi svoje opombe, kliknite Add a note.
Translation memory je spomin prevodov. Semkaj se shranjujejo že prevedeni nizi in nizi iz drugih datotek. Program vam bo predlagal že obstoječe prevode, ki jih lahko prekopirate ali pa samo delno uporabite.
Svetlo-modra obroba:
Ne pozabite sproti shranjevati sprememb, da ne bo delo šlo v nič.
Napredno
Sedaj, ko obvladate osnovne prijeme, pa se lahko pomaknemo na naprednejše funkcije programa. Ena izmed njih je posodobitev nizov iz predloge prevoda programa, datoteke .pot. V ta namen potrebujete predlogo (datoteko .pot) in že prevedene nize (datoteko .po).
Odprite datoteko .pot in izberite Sync > Odpri datoteko za uskladitev/spajanje. Izberite datoteko .po z že prevedenimi nizi in jo odprite. Sedaj izberite Sync > Copy all new translations ali pritisnite kombinacijo tipk Ctrl+Alt+A in datoteka se bo samodejno uskladila. Sedaj jo le še shranite in prevedite nize, ki niso bili samodejno prevedeni.
Preizkus prevoda
Da prevod preizkusite, morate datoteko .po pretvoriti v obliko .mo. V ta namen morate izvesti zunanji ukaz, saj Lokalize ne omogoča samodejne pretvorbe.
msgfmt -vc vhod.po -o izhod.moVhod in izhod zamenjajte s primernimi imeni datotek.
torek, 30. november 2010
Zapisnik 2. sestanka slovenskih prevajalcev
Na voljo je
Pregled prejšnjega zapisnika (glej: http://tinyurl.com/sestanek-20101025), ugotovitev kaj je bilo narejenega, stalne teme.
Zapisnik 2. sestanka slovenskih prevajalcev Ubuntuja
Sestanek 29. 11. 2010, 20.00 - 22.30
Udeleženci (po abecedi): Andrej Mernik, Andrej Žnidaršič, Darko Mohar, Dražen Matešić, Igor, Klemen Košir, Matej Urbančič, Mitja Pitko, Robert Založnik , Saša BatističPregled prejšnjega zapisnika (glej: http://tinyurl.com/sestanek-20101025), ugotovitev kaj je bilo narejenega, stalne teme.
- Prevajanje
- Od prejšnjega sestanka so bili prevedeni ali pregledani naslednji paketi:
- awn
- openshot
- pinta
- pychess
- shutter
- steadyflow
- supertuxkart
- ubuntu-tweak
- zim
- pulseaudio
- whois
- wget
- V gnome je bilo prevedenih ~ 3500 novih nizov + vsi spremenjeni nizi
- Izpostaviti je treba prevod ~200 zvokov za GCompris (program za otroke) - hvala Saša :)
- kubuntu-docs-directory, kubuntu-docs-about-desktop, ubuntu-docs-newtoubuntu
- Gnome rabi snemalca zaslonskih posnetkov - http://l10n.gnome.org/languages/sl/gnome-3-0/doc/ (Dražen, stopi v stik z Matejem)
- Komunikacija
- wiki - Izboljšati https://wiki.lugos.si/slovenjenje:ubuntu:kako-zaceti Darko
- Dražen je povedal Lugos adminu za težave s potrdilom
- Klemen pod slovnična pravila napiše nekaj o vejicah
- Dela prevajanje /iskanje napak se združita
- Dodati odsek “kaj potrebujem za prevajanje?”
- blog - deluje odlično, če bi kdo rad kaj napisal, naj reče za račun
- ideja - kako sem spoznal/a ubuntu?
- ideja - kako sem začel/a prevajati?
- Igor o svojemu izumu - glej 4. točko
- Srečanja (datum za decembrsko srečanje - morda prednovoletna fešta?)
- Od sedaj naprej načeloma vsako 2. sredo v mesecu ob 19.00 (prvič 8.12. ob 19.00).
- Andrej Ž. na ubuntu.si forum napiše nekaj o prednovoletni fešti in na podlagi odziva delamo naprej
- Iskanje novih prevajalcev (predpogoj so vodiči - za Poedit je že narejen) - od zadnjega srečanja že imamo 6 novih prevajalcev (kar dobro, glede na to, da je za 11.04 cilj 5 novih prevajalcev in da nismo izvajali nobene posebne promocije :).
- Trenutno je cilj predvsem izboljšanje navodil v wikiju in vodičev, s promocijo pa bomo začeli, ko se bo odprlo prevajanje 11.04.
- Darko ima wiki stran Kako Začeti
- Klemen en poseben dokument o Launchpadu
- Andrej M. vodič za Lokalise (na osnovi vodiča poedit)
- Izrazoslovje
- Prevajanje menijev za izklop v Ubuntu
- Odločili smo se za samostalniško obliko (poenoti Andrej)
- Poenoten prevod licenc (GNU GPL - Matej, Creative Commons (stik s Creative Commons Slovenija - Andrej Ž, čaka na odgovor))
- Pregled programov v Ubuntu 10.10 pred posodobitvijo jezikovnega paketa
- Dražen - Pulti, apleti, Transmission
- Darko - Rhythmbox, Empathy, Brasero
- Saša - PiTiVi
- Mitja - Ubuntu One, Videz
- Andrej Ž. - Shotwell, Čas in datum, Diskovna orodja
- Andrej M. - K3B in Kate
- Prevajanje tipk (Shift in podobno)
- Različna mnenja, se pogovorimo na pivu
- Drugo:
- Boljša integracija pojmovnika v prevajalski proces - npr. gostovanje dictd strežnika, koga ki bi sprogramiral vstavek za GTranslator, ki bi posvetil že znano besedo, ali skript za Firebird, ki bi prikazala na oblačku od miške ustrezen prevod besede v Launchpadu
- Igor je uredil skripto za pretvarjanje pojmovnika iz wikija v datoteko .dict Mogoče ga je najti tuka j(skupaj z navodili) - http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1450316/namigi.tar.gz
- En teden ga še preizkušamo, iščemo napake v navodilih nato pa objavimo na wiki-ju, Ubuntu.si, blogu. - navodila ostanejo v .pdf (zaradi oblikovanja)
- Igor bo v sodelovanju z Matejem skrbel za nadaljnjo usklajenost datotek .dict s pojmovnikom.
- Projekt translation standards
- Naša rešitev je mnogo boljša, zato se z njim ne bomo ubadali :)
- Razno
- Piknik poleti?
- Dodamo na aprilski dnevni red in se takrat dogovorimo. Načeloma zanimanje obstaja.
- Darko je predlagal da bi predstavljali Ubuntu. Damo na dnevni red za naslednjič.
- Naslednji sestanek bo zaradi praznikov predvidoma 21.12. ob 20.00. Dokončno se dogovorimo ob pivu 8.12. Če bomo imeli fešto, sestanek prestavimo na 2011.
Pivo bomo torej pili 8.12. Do 7.12. pa nam lahko pomagati iskati in odpravljati napake v prevodih. (če je mogoče preglejte paket, ki še ni na seznamu).
Predlagate pa lahko tudi nove teme za osnutek decemberskega sestanka. Najdete ga na https://docs1.google.com/document/d/1wxYj6kbxSiw7PBLJgRkxnuVTy0s53hOZwhT1ppMT--M/edit#
Naročite se na:
Objave (Atom)